Hey everybody, this is Trevor from
Belief It or Not here. And a lot of
people ask me the question, "You don't
believe in God. Why do you care? Why do
you talk about it so much?" Well, I have
Dave Farina here from Professor Dave
Explains. And Dave, what do you care
about?
>> I guess I guess most narrowly I care
about science and I care very
specifically about public perception of
science. As a science communicator, my
job is to act as kind of a conduit
between the scientific community and the
general public to help the public
understand what's going on in science,
who scientists are and what they do,
things of that nature. To zoom out, the
reason I care about that is because I
care about humanity and the future of
the human species and society and
everybody's right to pursue happiness
and freedom and things of that nature.
And I think science is tethered to that
and I especially think that um
uh the way the public views reality is
tethered to that because that determines
their voting and consumer behavior and
so forth. So, that would be it.
>> Awesome. I love that. Um so, how long
have you been uh doing the YouTube
thing?
>> So, quite a long time at this point. I'm
actually kind of a YouTube dinosaur. I
started in January 2015 was when the
channel was launched. So, over 11 years
I've been doing this, yeah.
>> That's uh Is there anything that's
surprising you that people are still
confused about when it comes to science
or or
>> Um I suppose it is shocking that there
still is even a single flat-earther in
the entire world. Um it's also kind of
shocking that people still so uh
hungrily consume flat-earth debunking
content. I would have thought people
would have been tired of it by now, but
I keep putting it down and then I'll
randomly do one and it's just like a
million views really quick on this
stuff.
>> [laughter]
>> Okay, man. You guys want this? I'll keep
doing it from time to time, but uh you
know, I'm doing more much more important
work in other areas. [laughter]
Um yeah.
>> Yeah, that blows my mind. Years ago,
like I used to do sketch comedy and I
was working on a sketch about where I
would play a flat-earther and I was like
trying to come up with the dumbest um
arguments I could come up with.
I couldn't come up with anything better
than what they were already doing.
There's I couldn't make a video because
I realized that there's no way people
are going to think I'm not a
flat-earther because the arguments are
already so ridiculous.
>> So stupid.
>> Yeah, cuz I even tried a couple in like
a
uh flat-earth debate page and I went in
there pretending to be a flat-earther
and nobody could tell that it was a
joke. Like cuz I said uh I have a ball
and I have a Frisbee. If I try to stand
on the ball, I fall over. If I stand on
the Frisbee, I'm fine. The earth is
flat.
>> Yeah.
>> And it's like, "Oh, that's basically the
way they argue anyway." So
>> Yeah, no, they they genuinely ex- they
think that the curvature curvature
should be as pronounced as like Le Petit
Prince, you know, with the guy standing
on the little like ball that's like this
big. Um yeah, they just have no capacity
for scale, you
>> Yeah, no, not at all.
>> [laughter]
>> Like their Mario Galaxy.
>> Yeah, exactly. Yeah, like that.
>> Yeah. [gasps]
Um what's what's grinding your gears
these days when it comes to bad science?
>> So, obviously just mountains of medical
misinformation, a lot of which is now
coming directly from the government and
various federal agencies within that are
led by Bobby Kennedy and his uh
underlings and just kind of generally
the uh Trump administration's
um attitude and behavior towards
science, which uh I just put out a video
last week on Russ Vought, uh who runs
the OMB, and this new ruling that will
essentially completely destroy the
American scientific community.
>> Yeah.
>> Um so, not to uh yeah,
you can watch that video. It's it's
quite a quagmire and I'll get all I'll
get all worked up if I start talking
[laughter] about it, but
it's really serious. It's very very
serious stuff.
>> Yeah, it really is. And it's it's scary
that the guy who famously ate a bunch of
road kill is now the guy saying like
this is how you should eat. This is how
you should This is the way medicine
works. It
>> Yes.
>> Yeah.
>> Yeah, the raw milk guzzling road kill
eating worm worm brain possessing freak
show
is in charge of American public health.
We should all try to wrap our heads
around that.
>> That's so scary.
>> Yeah.
>> So I I just released a video about how
hard it is for people to admit that they
don't know something, especially when it
is tied to their religion.
And admit that they're wrong. Just admit
that, okay, I don't know something.
Or someone might have a better answer
than
God did it.
It's
Why why do you think that is? Why do you
think people can't just like admit that
hey, maybe something isn't working up
here and maybe I should listen to people
whose brains are working.
>> Mhm. Well, religion is unique
in terms of how a world view is
constructed. It it thrives on dogma and
unwavering certainty
directly from divinity.
So
fundamentalists their scripture is
literally true. It's
unerring and no room for questioning and
to to to pretend you don't know
something is to admit the fallibility of
your religion and therefore your your
deity and therefore the certainty with
which you will enjoy
an afterlife in paradise and so
any kind of questioning the legitimacy
of the dogma is is
is is pulling the carpet the carpet out
from under their fear of mortality. And
so people react as literally as though
you're trying to kill them because in
their heads like you're trying to
destroy my precious afterlife dreams.
>> Right. Right.
>> So.
>> Yeah, that makes sense. It's Yeah, cuz
yeah, for them that is part of their
their extended life and you're
>> Yeah.
>> chopping it out.
>> take that away from them. Yeah.
>> Yeah, that makes sense. I guess I I've
been there.
Um
I uh
I can't stop thinking about you think
that because space is a vacuum that it's
a vacuum cleaner?
>> [laughter]
>> Okay, so you've seen my content. Yeah.
Yeah.
>> [laughter]
>> Uh that whole debate and like the
aftermath of that. Um
I guess is there going to be another
debate? [laughter]
>> With Lord Jamar no, he he is going to be
busy
trying to pretend I don't exist for the
rest of his life.
Um
but yeah, that and that's and that's not
new, right? He it's not just him. I he
is recycling things that he hears from
Eric Dubay and the other main kind of
flat Earth guru uh cult leaders. So I've
I've talked about that before. The
reason that interaction was so easy is
because he was just literally
regurgitating exact the exact script
I've already debunked so many times. So
I could off the top of my head crap on
all of it, but um but yeah, this is
stuff that that the main flat earthers
talk about, right? How can there be air
next to the vacuum of space? Shouldn't
space suck all the air up and it's just
like how
how long do you have to talk about how
dumb this is, you know? Like we can't
>> [laughter]
>> It's just insane.
>> Yeah, it's yeah, it's really insane. It
just it and I think you find that with
with so much of pseudoscience and and
just terribly arguments. It's not it's
not coming from curious minds. It's not
coming from people who actually want to
know how the world works. It's coming
from people who want to be right and
want to win an argument and want to be
different. And so yeah, you see those
scripts all the time. And and for me and
so like I struggle with debates because
part of me is like
one person like it's not a meeting of
minds. It's not two people who want to
get to the truth. If that were if that
were the case, yeah, awesome. But like
it's so often like one person who's like
I want to be right no matter what and I
am not going to
>> Yeah.
>> learn. Like learning is not an option
for them.
>> they're objectively wrong.
>> Yeah, [laughter] objectively wrong.
>> I mean, you can have debates. Like there
are things you can debate about. You
could debate about, you know, how should
we distribute the federal budget? Let's
have a debate about it. And I lean more
towards education and I lean more
towards this other thing. You can you
can debate that, but the shape of the
earth is not such a thing. And really
honestly in science there's
you don't debate science, right? You the
way you debate it is you publish papers
and you gather evidence and you put
forth a very compelling case in the
primary literature and then another
scientist might respond to it. And there
are there are contentious back and
forths. There are competing theories and
there are people who publish and try to
make their theory better than the other.
Um but like a debate like a circus
sideshow kind of a thing, which is what
all debates on science end up being,
which I participate in because they're
going to happen one way or the other and
I I I'd like to be in there and be the
one smacking down uh the opposition. Um
it's [clears throat] it you're right,
it's not a debate. It's it's it's an
educated person exposing a lying fraud.
>> Yeah.
>> Which I do with glee at the
>> [laughter]
>> at the opportunity. Yeah.
>> Yeah. And I think it was an old like
Daily Show thing where it's like if you
actually showed the the real like
science like you're not showing both
sides, it's because all the scientists
believe the truth. Like all the
scientists know how it actually works.
And then it's like one guy who's like
actually
>> [laughter]
>> Right. Oh, you're talking about the
climate stuff. Yeah. And that one
actually is always is always paid off by
fossil fuels
to to say so. Right. And they go on Joe
Rogan and you know, I'm actually an
expert and I'm actually going to tell
you the truth about climate science. No,
you're lying and Joe, you just refuse to
have on any of legitimate scientists
that will tell you the truth about
climate change. But yeah,
>> And then how do we how do you suggest
people deal with like their relatives
that say stuff like I don't believe in
evolution?
>> Well, there's a lot there's a lot of
ways you can react to that. One is to
just kind of exclude them from your life
indefinitely.
>> [laughter]
>> I don't have any experience with that
because I don't have any relatives that
are like that
and I choose not to associate with
people like that. But
but yeah, I mean it just depends how
much you want to ruin your relationship
with that person. I mean you can decide
to be very aggressive and try to convert
them to the side of reason.
Which I'm pretty argumentative. I
probably would would do that and I also
have a very low tolerance for
that [laughter] kind of [\h__\h] around like
the dinner table or something like that.
But there's a way to try to do it kind
of tactfully. There's a way to kind of
prod them with the Socratic method and
oh, you know, well, that's interesting.
Where did you hear that though? Why do
you believe that? You know, and try to
get them to see how vacuous their entire
world world view is without saying, you
know, this is how science works and
but it's kind of a
personal decision.
>> Yeah, for sure. 100%. Yeah, it's funny
too like cuz cuz me I've always been the
type like when somebody says, oh, I
don't believe in that evolution stuff.
My reaction is always like that's
they're not actually saying, oh, I want
to learn more about evolution or I want
to understand why you believe something
that's not believing. I just accept the
way the world works.
>> Right.
>> But
>> Yeah, we observe evolution every day.
Saying we I don't believe in evolution
is like saying I don't believe in
gravity. Like when flat-earthers say, I
don't believe in gravity. Well, it's you
know, it's right here all around us so I
don't know what you what you're even
talking about.
But yeah, what they're saying is
scientific facts disrupt my ability to
believe in some stories that make me
feel special namely God's deliberate
creation of humans precisely as we are
for some divine purpose.
It's not compatible with reality so they
choose to disregard reality in favor of
their
illusions.
>> Yeah. Yeah.
Would you mind reacting with me to a
sermon clip?
>> Okay.
>> Okay. So I already posted a reaction on
my Instagram and Facebook page to this
and we can go through to some of the
some of the comments I got only on
Facebook. I get the dumbest comments on
Facebook. I don't know what it is but
>> All the all the boomers are on there.
>> True. [laughter]
>> Yeah.
>> People talk about the Big Bang Theory. I
can disprove that right now.
Okay.
>> Do you think he's going to disprove it?
>> I do not think so. [laughter]
I don't he does not know what it is for
sure.
So
>> For sure.
>> You ever seen kids on a merry-go-round?
I'm about to destroy the Big Bang Theory
right now. THE BIG BANG THEORY SAYS that
from a little swirling dot something
exploded and then created the solar
system. A swirling dot, right?
>> Let's stop let's stop there. That's
that's already a great place to stop.
No it does not [\h__\h] say anything like
that. No it wasn't an it wasn't a dot.
There was no explosion and it did not
create the solar system. Our solar
system was created approximately 10
billion years after the initial
singularity.
Our
our star is not even the earliest
generation of stars.
So this is absolutely insane. He doesn't
know so number one obviously he has no
idea what what Big Bang cosmology
entails and is utterly unequipped to
talk about it but more importantly this
is what's interesting about the
hostility towards science is that more
sophisticated propaganda like Discovery
Institute.
Um
they actually embrace Big Bang
cosmology. They embrace any aspect of
science that they think can is
compatible with their propaganda. And
honestly, Big Bang cosmology is because
if you really really twist it
deliberately as much as possible, you
can argue that it aligns with the
account in Genesis, right? And so, you
really have to be dumb to fight against
it. A smarter
liar and science denier will say, "See,
Big Bang Here's good awesome science
that confirms the Abrahamic God going,
"Ooh, let there be light." And then
there was light and then all blah blah
blah blah blah. Um so, he's double dumb.
Double dumb.
>> Double dumb, yeah. Cuz I've heard so
many arguments, too, about
why in Genesis it says, "Let there be
light." And then 2 days later God
creates the sun.
>> Yeah.
>> And
a lot of people are like, "No, that
light that was the light from God. God
was the light that appeared then." And
then now a lot of them are taking Big
Bang cosmology and saying it was light
at the beginning and that's what it was
referring to.
>> Although there wasn't, right? The re-
the recombination era was a couple
hundred thousand years after the initial
singularity. That's when the when when
it was first transparent and able to to
transmit electromagnetic radiation. So,
still before the sun, quite a bit before
the sun,
>> [clears throat]
>> but not at t equals zero, so.
>> Yeah, exactly.
>> So, the dot is swirling, right? And
something exploded, that means
everything else in the solar system
should be spinning in the same
direction.
Because if kids FLY OFF A
MERRY-GO-ROUND, THEY'RE all going to be
flying off in the same direction. Yeah,
but there are planets that spin in
opposite directions.
>> [screaming]
>> Wow.
>> Okay, so, is that the whole clip?
>> That's the whole clip.
>> Okay, so, yeah, I mean, how long do we
want to talk about
>> [laughter]
>> But so, the point is that I mean, how
quickly can we summarize all this? You
had an initial singularity and
just energy that then very quickly
congealed into matter. So you have very
very a quark gluon plasma and then as
the temperature comes down different
things become possible. So nucleons
become possible after it cools
sufficiently and then there's even a
time period where where Big Bang
nucleosynthesis is happening. So protons
and neutrons are able to fuse. You get
some helium, a little bit of lithium.
Then it has to cool down even more for
electrons to be able to couple with
nuclei. So that's when you first get
neutral atoms. So you're you're talking
about like a couple million years after
the initial singularity where you have
just it's stable enough
and [clears throat] cool enough
that you just have a bunch of hydrogen
and some helium floating around. They
begin to collect by gravity and form
stars. Right? What when enough
enough dust enough gas collects that
there's intense gravitational pressure
inwards, that triggers fusion. So then
you get that that that's what pushes
outwards. That's a star. It's when you
have enough gas or dust in later
generations of stars that the tremendous
pressure inwards triggers fusion and
then that fusion makes that hydrogen and
other stuff glow. That's what a star is.
And so you have stars that
in all the stars are are in galaxies and
um
so we're talking about way way way way
way after the Big Bang. And then there's
many generations of of stars because
once a star runs out of fuel, it's going
to go supernova. But in the meantime
it's fused all of these other nuclei of
different elements in there. So that
gets thrown out and then
at at the earliest the second generation
of stars, now these protoplanetary disks
cuz they're going to form stars again,
have all of these other elements in
them. So they're able to form planets.
So
this cloud of gas and dust will collect
and you have a central star with 99
point whatever percent of the mass and
then these other bodies that form at
random
distances from from the star, and those
are going to be planets and some the
planets many of them have moons as well.
Um
And so,
it's true, right? Conservation of
angular momentum would dictate that that
all that all the planets spin the same
way. That's true and orbit the the
central star at the same way. However,
things happen, right? There can in in an
early solar system, it's a very chaotic
system. So, things are colliding all the
time.
And so, you know, whether
an object towards the exterior collides
with a planet more inward and and shifts
its rotational axis or even causes it to
spin the other way. So, you have a
formation of a solar system, but then
things happen, collisions occur. And
you know, just the
the the laws of physics dictate that
when collisions happen, it's going to
change the way things spin or perturb an
orbit in a certain way. So,
yeah, the guy just has no [\h__\h] idea
about anything, literally anything.
It's astounding. Yeah.
>> And I and I love the argument too and
this is this happens all the time with
any pseudoscience, with any like my
religion's right so that the science has
to be wrong is I don't understand it
personally so it can't be true.
>> Yeah, exactly. Yeah, it's the assertion
of your own profound ignorance over the
over the totality of human knowledge.
That's what's so arrogant about science
deniers in general, but obviously coming
from a fundamentalist perspective. It's
like I get that thousands of years ago
nobody had any clue what has ever
happened or what anything is, but now we
do. So, you have a choice to either
catch up, you can
apply yourself and learn basic
information about all sciences, or you
can just not and then your opinion
doesn't matter, right?
It just doesn't matter at all.
>> Agreed. Like I don't think anybody yeah,
who has these opinions should be making
any decisions whatsoever. Or speaking
publicly. Or speaking publicly.
[laughter]
>> Yeah.
>> Yeah. Yeah, it it
boggles my mind. But, have you ever seen
a bunch of kids fly off a
merry-go-round?
>> I can't say I have. That would be a
little that would be a a minor disaster.
>> Yeah, that would be pretty bad. And the
first thing I wouldn't be immediately
thinking about, "Oh, actually this makes
me think of the solar system.
>> Yeah, totally.
>> God's God's making these children get
hurt in front of me because he's trying
to teach me a lesson here."
>> Yeah, also is though like flat-earthers
have this too. Like he's trying to
pretend that the solar system is like
rotating super rapidly.
Well, all the all the planets have
orbital periods of years and years and
years. And then the Earth as well,
right? They try to pretend, "Oh, it's
spinning so fast. How could the Earth be
spinning so fast we don't feel it?"
Spins once a day, dude.
>> Yeah.
>> One time in 24 hours. Get on a
merry-go-round and have it spin one time
in 24 hours.
Pretty intense, huh?
>> Yeah.
>> Not [laughter] so much.
>> Nope, not at all. I'm going to an
amusement park this weekend. I'll I'll
see if they can do that for me. Just
just as a test. [laughter]
>> Yeah.
>> Let's see if I'll show you some of the
or I'll see if I can find some of the
comments here. They're just brilliant.
And and maybe
maybe they're right, you know?
So, if there was nothing to begin with,
how did the Big Bang happen from
nothing? So, this guy's moving the goal
posts.
>> Yeah.
Yeah, moving the goal posts. Although to
to play devil's advocate, I mean it it
it's a reasonable like to understand the
origin of the universe is a very
understandable confusion.
>> Yeah.
>> Uh so, it's not it's not he's not
phrasing it quite right. Nobody is
suggesting that there was nothing when
that initial singularity occurred. It
didn't come from nothing.
But, nevertheless,
it is okay to be confused about the
origin of the universe. We do not have a
resoundingly firm empirical
understanding of the origin of the
universe at t equals zero.
At around t equals -4 10 to the -42
seconds, we start to know a little bit.
After 10 to the -36 seconds, we know
more. And after 10 to the -12, so
starting one 1 trillionth of a second
after the initial singularity, we know a
lot.
Electroweak theory very very firmly
describes that epoch and then beyond, we
know even more. Um but that first little
tiny trillionth of a second, we don't
know. We don't know. And so it is okay
to go, "Well, we don't know and so I'm
not sure." And honestly, it's okay to
go, "A god went like that and that's
what happened." And I don't really care
if people believe in in that god. As
long as you go, "A god went like that
and that started the universe and then
the rest unfolded according to our
scientific understanding." That is a
That is a deism that does not bother me
at all. I don't share it, but I don't
even I don't even care to argue it with
you. It's not an interesting
conversation to me. So.
>> Yeah, my my whole thing is like, believe
what you want to believe as long as it's
not hurting people.
Um and that's the main thing. And bad
science does hurt people. So I think
that um
not allowing kids to learn about
evolution in school, that not only hurts
the kids, it hurts future generations.
>> Of course.
>> So um
and then yeah, let's see. Oh yeah, there
wasn't a big bang everything that exists
was created. But the created is in all
caps. So that's helpful. Um
>> Yeah. Well, I mean, what's what's wrong
with the a more intellectually
defensible version of creation
incorporates Big Bang cosmology. That a
god went like that and then the rest
unfolded according to cosmo- cosmology.
In fact, that's not even really
creationism rigidly speaking. That's
more uh deism.
>> Yeah. Yeah.
And the idea that um
I mean, yeah, some people just have that
idea that snap, god started it and then
he's like cool cool cool and then other
ones are like he's moving the pieces as
on the board as it goes.
>> creationism, yeah.
>> Yeah. Yeah.
>> Which is hilarious too by the way. I
mean it's like what a loser impotent God
that you believe in that he's like I'm
going to start a universe. Okay,
nothing's happening. Let me like tweak
it a little bit and then okay, now we
got a planet. That's kind of cool, but
there's not I wanted to like have stuff
moving around thinking stuff. How do I
do that? Okay, let me let me push these
molecules together. Ooh, I have a
bacterium now. Okay, that's pretty cool.
Now but I want more like like monster
stuff. How do I do that? Oh, let me let
me change some stuff and then
Like what a loser God. Like why don't
you believe in a God that is powerful
enough to to create a universe with all
of the parameters in place such that
life will arise. Yeah, exactly. That's a
much cooler God to believe in, you know.
>> Yeah.
This is from the same guy who did that
what happened at the beginning or how
did it start thing, but he said but you
pretend this whole complex world popped
up from nothing like magic, right? I
guess you kind of addressed that.
>> No, that's that's what they believe.
>> Yeah, exactly. [laughter]
>> That they believe God farted out a magic
universe.
>> Yeah.
>> There's no physical mechanisms described
or elucidated in that belief system.
>> Yeah.
>> Um so from nothing is a straw man, um
but you know, if you really want to talk
about that first trillionth of a second
after the initial singularity, we don't
know and also what what caught what
brought about the singularity. I don't
know, nobody knows, fine. Um but the the
other problem here is that the the
precise logic associated with being
confused about a universe existing
without cause is never applied to their
deity. They believe in a deity that
exists without cause, an infinitely more
complex deity that exists without cause
and I don't think about that for a
second. That's that's very hypocritical,
right? Where what's what's the cause of
your deity? And if you want to go, "Oh,
well, he was always there." So, only
things that begin to exist have a cause,
but he is in Well, why does existing
infinitely into the past or outside of
time, why do those things make sense?
This is also a cop-out.
>> Right.
>> Um you just want there to be a god.
>> Yeah.
>> And so, just logic it's it's a logically
incoherent position to be angry about a
universe existing without cause and then
believing in an infinitely more complex
deity that exists without cause.
>> Exactly.
>> doesn't work.
>> Yeah.
>> So.
>> Can infinite regress exist?
>> I don't know. I don't think so. It's
it's not it's illogically inconsistent
to me, but
>> Yeah.
>> [laughter]
>> Cuz that's one of the arguments I hear
all the time from creationists is like,
"Infinite regress can't exist, therefore
a god." But it's like I doesn't that the
same thing? Like
>> [laughter]
>> Yeah, no, their deity is they have to
apply that to the deity as well. There's
no argument you can put forward for the
universe existing without a deity not
making sense that doesn't then apply to
that deity. Where's the Where does the
deity come from? Is there a super god
that made the god? It's all the way
back, you know what I mean? It that's
believing in a god necessitates
an infinite regress of some kind.
>> Yeah.
>> So, to me, it's it's just Occam's razor.
I just believe the simplest thing that
there is a universe and there is no god.
It doesn't mean that there that there
cannot be a god. I just see no evidence
for one and the simplest
uh worldview to me is atheism. It's the
simplest view.
>> Yeah.
>> I can't disprove god. I can just point
out how uh illogical arguments for god
of this nature are. They're just [\h__\h]
arguments. So.
>> Yeah. Exactly. And it's like again,
believe what you want. If you if that
brings you comfort, cool, cool. It's
It's not for me. That doesn't bring me
comfort, but if it works for you, again,
don't
cause harm.
>> Yeah.
>> Don't use it to be like, "You know, this
causes me comfort, so you can't marry
that person.
>> Yeah, exactly. Or we are going to enact
a fascistic takeover of the government
with Orwellian mass surveillance and
take away all your rights and shift all
of the money into the oligarchy.
>> Yeah, exactly. Yeah, I'm not a fan of
those things.
Um
were you surprised or did you kind of
see it coming with the kind of anti-vax,
anti-mask stuff with COVID?
>> I
I think I saw it coming, but I think
that
No, I I did see it coming, but there a
little bit of you wants to naively
think, "Okay, we're facing a global
pandemic. People are going to value
medical technology and vaccines and
stuff now." But
I mean, yeah, it's given the
conspiratorial nature of the public and
the way they've presented themselves
over the past 20 years or so, obviously
it's going to be the vaccines are poison
and you know, COVID is a bioweapon and
and or viruses aren't even real in the
first place. This is 5G stuff. Or Bill
Gates is putting a microchip in the
whatever, you know,
varying gradations of insanity.
But it I I would say that I am slightly
surprised as how widespread and
mainstream this brand of science denial
has become, how thoroughly it has
infected the public. There are multiple
lines of pseudoscience and anti-science
propaganda that have infected genuinely
the majority of the public, especially
in America.
And that they just will not hear
anything to the contrary. They will not
hear
that that COVID vaccines did not kill a
bunch of people or harm millions of
people. They will not hear that that
SARS-CoV-2 was zoonotic origin from the
Huanan Market. All of the
epidemiological data confirms this. They
will not hear that Fauci isn't some
maniac
horrible monster man. They just the the
propaganda was just so thoroughly
drilled into the heads of the public and
it would just it's we can't recover from
it, you know? It's just I it's crazy to
watch.
>> Yeah. I talk about this so often, but
like I remember I was in an Uber at the
beginning of
COVID and the guy said something about I
just can't wait till things get back to
normal and I looked at him and I was
like, I don't think anything's ever
going to go back to the way it was. Like
>> I don't know in the long run, but not
right now. It's getting worse. It's
getting way worse before it gets any
better.
>> Oh, yeah. 100% in so many different
ways. It It just It blows my mind.
Um do you see anything kind of seeping
in now that you are afraid is going to
get worse as far as science denialism
and things like that? Or
>> I mean from the perspective of the
public, it's hard to say because I think
we are starting to see the very first
signs of blowback from MAGA and MAHA as
they start to piece together that this
was all [\h__\h] from day one. Um Bobby
is losing MAHA over glyphosate and PFAS
and stuff that he
uh very vocally said he wanted to
regulate and then did the precise
opposite and deregulated. So, there are
people that are were firmly brainwashed
by MAHA that are like, wait a minute. Um
so, we're starting to see that a little
bit and then MAGA too. I mean, Trump is
just
the approval rating is abysmal
for a number of reasons. I mean, the
Iran war in particular, but um
so, I just I'm not sure how that's going
to play out if we're going to see a full
blowback to the point where the public
unites a little bit more in terms of
getting this administration out of
office. So, and that will that I mean,
I'm very curious to see what happens
with the midterms and if Trump tries to
do anything to
outright cancel the midterms, steal some
of them. I don't know what's going to
happen, but it's it's going to get
really dark really soon because he, if
he survives to the end of his term, will
not leave peacefully. He absolutely will
not. He's already openly admitted that
he's going to violate the Constitution
and try to attain a third term.
And even if he does die,
the powers behind him will continue.
They will have lost their Hitlerian
figurehead, but all the machinery behind
him is
going to continue to be intact.
So, we need a lot of grassroots politics
ground up that will take a very long
time to to take hold and then, you know,
get back the Supreme Court and all this
other stuff. So, I just don't see this
resolving anytime soon, and in the
meantime, it could get so much worse.
So, I'm worried. Yeah.
>> Yeah. Fair enough. It's it's a scary
it's a scary world in it. Like as
somebody who doesn't live in America,
but lives very darn close,
you see it
it's going to the rest of the world. It
doesn't just affect America.
>> Yeah. Yeah, the rise of fascism is is is
global. I I dare I say there's a little
bit of it in Canada, but definitely in
Germany and Italy and
yeah, it it's it's it's happening. So.
>> Yeah, we're getting constant commercials
in Ontario about how safe the government
is making the country, and it's all just
more police
>> Right.
>> on more corners and Like homelessness is
basically becoming illegal, and
things like that where it's like, how do
we not see this? This isn't safer. This
is fascism.
>> Yeah.
>> How do we not understand what's
happening here? But you use the word
we're making your streets safer enough,
they're they're forgetting what the
consequences of that safe street is.
>> safer with a with a masked Gestapo that
can murder anyone with complete
impunity.
>> Yeah.
>> Um and we will see this we will see I
mean it's it's
I I'm just I'm really scared that it is
going to come to a head in full-scale
[snorts]
revolution, which in my estimation is
needed currently at this point
full-scale American rev like French
Revolution style
>> Yeah.
>> revolution, which will swiftly be met
with mass murdering uh of people. And I
don't know if Americans are up for it,
right? There are other countries that I
see do like what's going on in Albania
right now is like inspiring. I'm
watching that. I'm like, "Hell yeah.
>> Yeah.
>> Go get that [\h__\h] Albania. [\h__\h] yes."
And then obviously, you know, Gaza and
stuff. But um
Americans aren't I don't think cut out
for it at least not in the large enough
numbers required.
>> Yeah.
>> I think too many people are like, "Fuck
it. I got my iPhone. I got my Netflix.
Like just leave me alone."
>> Yeah.
>> And I don't necessarily blame them. Like
I don't want to get murdered on the
street. I have kids. Like I don't So I
just don't know what's going to happen
even though I believe that like really
full-scale revolution is necessary
currently today.
>> Yeah.
>> Already. Uh so
>> Yeah. Like my sister lives in California
and um
she's trans and an immigrant and she was
stopped by ICE the other day.
And like she has her green card and
everything. She's there very legally,
but it's still a very scary experience
to be a trans person,
an immigrant,
married to somebody of Mexican descent,
um
>> Triple checking triple boxes there.
>> Yeah. And getting stopped by ICE and
then in the middle of it uh the ICE
agent's like, "Why are you acting so
nervous?"
Oh, I don't know cuz if I say one wrong
word, I'm in a prison.
>> me.
>> Yeah. You could murder
>> me.
>> Yeah.
>> [laughter]
>> Like it just yeah, it's it's a very
scary time and I think um yeah. It's
it's [snorts] time people stand up. I
think if people aren't standing up yet,
it's time now.
Yeah, I
was on Tik Tok the other day and
somebody posted a video about how
protests don't really work and um I I
commented
like yeah, they do. And then um I got a
lot of angry feedback cuz some I don't
know if I worded it wrong or how it
worked out, but a bunch of people
thought I was saying that the only way
to protest was
uh legally and the only way to protest
was peacefully. Um and I just want to be
clear on the record. That's not what I'm
saying. I'm just saying protesting is
one of the options.
>> I support revolutionary action from
those who are brave enough to do it. But
in the meantime, peaceful protest does
work.
>> Yeah.
>> Um it and has become dangerous in in the
interim, not just in terms of physical
violence from a militaristic police
force, but also social ramifications.
They are cracking down. I mean, what
happened in in just
pro-Palestine sentiment being treated as
terrorism or terrorism-adjacent. Like
this is what's happening now. They
Israel is so desperate. They have so
thoroughly lost the PR war despite
buying out media
you know, networks and and just the
billions per year of propaganda that
they pump into the into the ecosystem.
The whole world knows what Israel is
now. They have lost conclusively. And so
all they can do is strong-arm
governments into into punish into
punitive damage for anybody who supports
Palestine.
>> Yeah.
>> Um or Lebanon or Syria or you know, just
they like if you if you are
pro-Palestine, we're going to get you
fired. We're going to try to throw you
in jail. We're going to do anything we
can to silence this [\h__\h] And it's just
it that is where I mean, this is where
we're seeing fascism most most clearly
in the suppression of free speech in
opposition towards genocide. So.
>> Yeah, it's it's and but they got Gwyneth
Paltrow now. So, things should shift, I
guess.
>> What a [\h__\h] [\h__\h] I don't I don't
mind calling her that. She gets she gets
to see what
>> Yeah, there there are certain people who
get that word. Yeah, exactly. Cuz even
like
when I flew cuz I'm not going to America
right now once Trump came back in the
office. I'm like, okay. Well, I have
been to just when it was the first
couple months that he was back in
office. I have been down to visit my
sister.
But since then I'm like, I'm just going
to wait until things change at least
till like if there's big changes after
the midterms or when he's gone. I'm just
not going to Yeah.
>> Yeah.
But even like I flew to England in in
March and cuz I have my like
pro-Palestine pins and stuff and I was
like, do I take this off when I cross
the border? Like when I go through?
Yeah. And I think I ended up just
putting a like on a different sweater or
whatever, but it was like that's a scary
thing that like something so simple like
I don't think children should be
genocided
could end up like
>> Yeah.
>> [laughter]
>> Yeah, it just it it
>> Are you in Hamas?
>> Yeah.
I like hummus.
>> Yeah, Israeli hummus, right? Israeli
hummus, Israeli couscous. They have to
put Israeli before everything that they
steal to to make you you know, it is we
made it. Believe us. Yeah. There's a
Palestinian singer at the World Cup
right now and Israel is like claiming
her as an Israeli. I know, isn't that
bananas? It's just like you guys are so
pathetic. Like you just have to take
everything. They tried to take the
watermelon. They tried to turn that into
an Israel thing. It's just like good
god. You're just so worthless, such
disgusting,
you know, parasites that just take
everything. And you don't just take land
and lives, you steal culture, you steal
essence because you have none. Israelis
have no culture, they have nothing. It's
a made-up country. They don't have
anything, so they have to take the
culture of the indigenous people and
present it as their own. It's so
pathetic.
>> Yeah, it's yeah, it's pathetic, it's
disgusting, and it's um
And yeah, and then they try to
villainize you for for any sort of
disagreement.
>> Yep.
>> It's yeah.
And it's like yeah, I mean, my country
has a bad history with this stuff, too.
In fact, like they probably stole some
of our tactics with the way we treated
the indigenous people and
but it's like this is happening right
now before our eyes.
>> Yeah.
>> And
>> Yeah, I mean, Western colonialism, you
know, we all knew we know the history of
Western colonialism and we know Britain
was the great leader and then America
touched the took the torch and
everything, but it's just wild for it to
be happening in 2026.
>> Yeah.
>> Right now, a belligerent ethno-state is
stealing is stealing Palestine and
stealing Lebanon and stealing Syria. And
they're just expect the world to just
go, "Oh, that's cool. Yeah, go ahead."
>> It's fine.
>> You think we're going to just be a cool
with it?
>> Yeah.
>> So, I don't know what's going on like
just with the geopolitically
like what they did to the to the
European flotilla, now Europe is like
"Okay, you guys, this is bananas that
you think you can do this to Europeans."
And so, hopefully sanctions are coming.
Iran is bombing the [\h__\h] out of Israel,
so it's like I like they're finally
getting some comeuppance, but I just
don't know how far they're going to be
able to go with it and also what
Israel's response is going to be. Right
now, they're trying to integrate the
Israeli and American militaries. Did you
hear about this?
>> No, I hadn't heard about that.
>> They're trying to integrate the two
militaries. They will be one military,
which means a couple of things. Number
one,
no congressional approval needed for
money sent over there. And number two,
if they institute a draft, which they've
been trying to do for a while now,
American young men and women can be
drafted to fight for Israel. So, my
kids, who are half Palestinian, could
get drafted to go and murder
Palestinians. They'd be forced, legally
forced to do it.
>> Can you
>> wrap your head around that? I mean, my
kids are very little, so I we'd be gone
way before they would have to do that,
but there's
no chance in hell I would take the risk
of them having being drafted into the
Israeli military. It's insane.
>> Jesus.
>> Yep.
>> Yeah.
Uh what a time to be alive.
>> [laughter]
>> You almost can't believe it. You almost
can't
>> Yeah.
>> believe it. You think about it and
you're like, this is you could barely
even write this in like a dystopian I
mean, uh Handmaid's Tale is the closest
where you're like, this is scary because
this is like basically exactly how it
would totally go. Um but it feels like
that. It feels like the beginning of
becoming Gilead and you're just
>> Well, I mean, so pretty much all, if not
most, um dystopian futures are really
just things happening to people around
the world and they make it white.
>> And then they right and amp it up, you
know, 50% but yeah, totally.
>> Yeah. It's uh yeah. I guess we can go
into the lightning round.
>> Sure.
>> already discussed who your uh current
nemesis is, so that's um
>> Who, Lord Jamar?
>> Yeah.
>> [laughter]
>> Lord Jamar or Bobby.
>> Oh, yeah, Bobby would be more of a
nemesis, although it's not he doesn't
think about me as much as I think about
him. He's got a lot of people on his
tail. Um but yeah, anyone in the
administration pedaling disinformation
would be would be number one.
>> Are you an early bird or are you a night
owl?
>> I'm both. I barely sleep. Uh
I go to bed around 1:00, I wake up
around 6:00, 6:30.
>> Okay. And then, is there any uh TV show
you're currently watching?
>> Oh, uh right now we are binging
Shameless.
>> Okay.
>> I never watched it. We uh my wife had
watched a few seasons and was always
like, "Let's watch this." And then I was
like, "It's 11 seasons." And then
finally we watched we started it and I
was like, "I really like this show."
>> Okay. [laughter]
>> So, we're on like season 8 or something
and I'm like I just I want to see what
happens to these these people.
>> Yeah.
>> They're so flawed but but lovable and I
don't know. It's a yeah. It's a good
show.
>> Yeah. Okay. I'll I'll I actually haven't
watched Shameless. I've seen a lot of TV
but not Shameless, so.
Um what movie are you watching right
now?
>> Uh I can't remember the last time I
watched In general I watch so few movies
but what was the last movie that I
watched? I can't I straight up can't
even
think of one. Is there one that came out
recently? I haven't been to the theater
since pre-COVID.
>> Oh, wow.
>> Which is yeah. I might go for Odyssey.
>> Okay.
>> Although I do not I just I'm such like a
I love like Greek mythology so much and
it's so like uh nostalgic, you know,
like I have a thing about it. I just
don't think that it's going to be good
but I'm going to see it anyway.
>> Yeah.
>> So.
>> Here's the thing. I
I don't I've never said this uh
publicly. I'm not a huge Christopher
Nolan guy.
>> Yeah.
>> I uh
>> Yeah, I I do think I said this in a
recent podcast that I think he's
overrated. I I think that he's made
really really good movies. I think he's
a great director but I but he seems to
be inhabiting this like number one spot
in Hollywood and I'm like, "That seems a
little bit of a stretch."
>> that's what it is. Yeah, I just I like
him. He's I just feel like
>> Dark Knight is amazing.
>> Yeah.
>> Dark Knight is so freaking good. Um and
he has, you know, Interstellar's a
really good movie. Like he has good
Inception is
Inception's a very good movie. I'm not
going [laughter] to say it's not a good
movie. It's a little, you know,
deliberately obtuse but um
>> Yeah.
>> Um but he makes good movies. It's just
>> Yeah.
>> I don't know. He's like I would say he
makes the top 10 list of current
directors but uh
>> Yeah.
>> He Yeah, I would say that too. Yeah,
especially like Yeah, I'm I'm looking
forward to some of the new guys coming
up. I think there's some like Obsession.
I haven't seen Backrooms yet, but
Obsession I really liked and
>> Yeah, I didn't see either of those, but
in general I like the idea of, you know,
fresh voices and
Yeah.
>> Same. And then what is your go-to candy?
>> Candy.
My kids are really into Haribo gummy
bears and I hadn't really had them in
like a million years, but now that
they're into them we always have a huge
thing in the pantry and now
you know, definitely at least once a day
I'm like, "Oh, all right, let's get some
let's get some gummy bears."
>> Yeah.
>> Those are really good. I'm not too much
of a candy guy, but I definitely have
those from time to time.
>> Yeah. Where can people find you?
>> Professor Dave Explains on YouTube.
>> Yeah.
Love it. Um thank you so much for coming
on.
>> Thanks for having me.